Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
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Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
Surfpath,
Using EndAmps on a Charge Controller is often not a bad way to end Absorption -- that is what is used on all systems here. As you probably know, the current being output from a CC is going toward the batteries, and includes loads of inverters and ON inverters, and less common are any DC loads connected directly to the batteries.
If these loads on the battery bank are fairly constant, they can be accounted for by adding them to the desired EA value. This EA value does not need to be perfect. If changing loads on inverters upset the amount that you have added to your desired ending CC current on a given day, this is often not a huge deal, especially on 48 V systems and largish battery banks, as the variable portion of the CC output current from these loads are smaller than the relatively large current required to finish charging a larger bank, and for 48 V systems compared to 12 V or 24 V systems.
Furthermore, the battery bank integrates the total charge current that has been returned to the battery bank over a period of days, AND, the varying loads would need to be active only during the period of several minutes to 30 seconds just prior to the EA value being satisfied, causing the end to Absorb. For example, in the warm months here, an A/C unit is run in power rooms. Its thermostat is adjusted where is always will cycle ON/OFF every few minutes. This A/C, when running, adds about 10 DC Ams to current the CC must supply to maintain Vabs, but since it cycles off every few minutes, its effect on delaying termination is only those few minutes that the A/C is running at the very end of Abs. A reasonably sized 48 V bank would never know the difference.
Some battery monitors like the FNDC have the ability to measure the actual charge current going into the battery, but there have been a few issues with the FW for the FNDC, as I read it. The soon-to-be-released MidNite Battery Current Monitor device will have the ability to end Abssoprion stage of Classic CCs based on current into the batteries as well.
Am not very familiar with the FM series CCs from OB. But the MX has a Min and Max Absorption time setting. And uses these, in some combination with Bulk time, ONLY when the EA setting is 00 A. If the EA value is non-zero, the Min Abs time is ignored, and Absorb is terminated either when the EA value is satisfied, OR Max time is reached. And so on. Good Luck, and it is very good that you are paying close attention those new batts, VicOff Grid - Two systems -- 4 SW+ 5548 Inverters, Surrette 4KS25 1280 AH X2@48V, 11.1 KW STC PV, 4X MidNite Classic 150 w/ WBjrs, Beta KID on S-530s, MX-60s, MN Bkrs/Boxes. 25 KVA Polyphase Kubota diesel, Honda Eu6500isa, Eu3000is-es, Eu2000, Eu1000 gensets. Thanks Wind-Sun for this great Forum. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"when end of charge SG's are about 1.240/1.235....ie. when I am cycling from 80% to 50%?
When you did equalization, you put in 29AH. Most of this got lost because of the bubblig. So, you probably added no more than 15AH. If you assume that after equalization you had 100% in your battery (370AH) then before equalization it couldn't be less than (370-15) = 355AH. This means that your SOC was no worse than (355/370*100) = 96%. The SG is 1.240 because the electrolyte is not mixed well enough, which, in turn, may be explained by the lack of bubbling during your absorptions.
You probably start your week cycling between 85 and 100% SOC, then in two weeks it degardes to 80 to 95% SOC. Then you bring it back to 100% SOC with equalization and everyhing starts over.
If you would start cycling 50 to 80% SOC, it'd be a totally different pattern. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
Here is how I set up a bank. If your charge controller has ending amps, then you'd do it automatically with the controller, if you trust it. You have still know the background amp draw present on your inverter. Example : mine is 6 amps + the 7.4 amps your 2 % = 14 Ending amps.Hi Blackcherry,
You said: "You got to love a Post that says " My Batteries are in Float by 11:00 everyday " but never a detail of ending amps or % being accepted prior to going into Float. Even if you only have Voltage and Time on your charging source, you can use a clamp on amp meter to find the amps going into the batteries and you should be able to adjust the source to give you the ending amps you need prior to going to Float."
I'd like to learn a little more about the (Outback) end amps feature. Perhaps this will help me to tinker with absorb times. In an earlier post I did detail my daily AMP usage on a chart. I am also aware of the 2% recommendation (7.4 AMPS for my bank) if one is to enter an end-amp value. However are you suggesting another more accurate way to set this feature?
1) a volt meter on the battery post.
2) a clamp on Amp meter.
Set your time and Voltage in the CC or what ever source you have. Watch the switch from Absorb to Float and start to adjust the time and Voltage until the acceptance of the Battery bank ( Current ) matches the Ending Amps target you have. You have to look at the Sun hours you have average available. If your bulk takes 2 hours and you only have 3 hours to absorb, you'd probably want to adjust the Voltage upward and pull the time back some. It takes you a couple days to do it the first time, you learn how the bank reacts and it's easy to make adjustments.
You only have 3 things you can adjust when charging a battery, Voltage, Time, & Current. Change any one , you change the other.
You can't really set anything without having a Healthy Bank. I wouldn't waste my time without Equalizing and getting the SG's up to their maximum. As I mentioned above you have to consider the average Sun Hours available in a full charging cycle. If the Bulk cycle is eating up your available time, then you need more panels and / or another controller to increase the available current and shorten the Bulk time. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
OK, complexish, requiring me to be at home. Will have to wait for the weekend. I'll 'absorb' your advice and also read the CC manual again. Thanks for helping me down this path.Blackcherry04 wrote: »Set your time and Voltage in the CC or what ever source you have. Watch the switch from Absorb to Float and start to adjust the time and Voltage until the acceptance of the Battery bank ( Current ) matches the Ending Amps target you have. You have to look at the Sun hours you have average available. If your bulk takes 2 hours and you only have 3 hours to absorb, you'd probably want to adjust the Voltage upward and pull the time back some. It takes you a couple days to do it the first time, you learn how the bank reacts and it's easy to make adjustments.
Hmm...When it comes to the outback FM CC it appears you can't completely adjust absorb time. I have not been able to find a screen that allows you to set a minimum absorb time. So far 4 folks on this forum have said that I should or, more neutrally, can increase my absorb time. No one has been able to show me how this can be accomplished on an FM80.Blackcherry04 wrote: »You only have 3 things you can adjust when charging a battery, Voltage, Time, & Current. Change any one , you change the other.Outback Flexpower 1 (FM80, VFX3048E-230v, Mate, FlexNetDC) 2,730watts of "Grid-type" PV, 370 AmpHrs Trojan RE-B's, Honda 2000 watt genny, 100% off grid. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
Have you visited this forum?
http://www.outbackpower.com/forum/index.php
gww -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
Page 55 in the Manual.
http://www.outbackpower.com/docman/0307121010258900-0009-01-00RevB.pdf
Absorb Time Limits (Advanced Menu)
The amount of time the charge controller stays in the Absorbing stage of charging can be adjusted in
the Absorb Time Limits screen. An Absorbing charge stage normally ends when the battery voltage is
maintained at the Absorbing set point for the time period set in the Absorb Time Limits screen.
Absorb Time is adjustable from 0 to 24 hours (consult the battery manufacturer’s recommendations).
When the Absorb Time Limit is reached, the charge controller goes into Float stage and may briefly display
Charged, then Float. When the battery voltage drops below the Float voltage set point, the charge
controller recharges to maintain this set point, employing the MPPT function in MPPT Float mode.
Absorb End Amps (Advanced Menu)
While the battery voltage is at or above the Absorbing voltage target (see page 26) and the
Absorb End Amps value is reached for a time delay of 15 seconds, the charge controller will switch to
the Float stage. This happens regardless of the charger time minutes as shown in the Misc menu
under ChgT (see page 50). The charger timer will be reset to zero.
Page 90 for the Mate menu.
. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I have been holding of commenting on this thread until I had some data. I have the same battery set up (16) Trojan L16RE 370ah each, 48V-740ah bank. I really struggled for a number of months trying to get a full charge on my bank and I have 4Kw of panel. There were a number of issues and I followed a couple of dead ends. Initially I was only getting about 1hr of absorb @ 59.2v and then go to Float. There was an issue with having 2 Classic 200’s and which one was in control. Upgrade to firmware (“Follow Me”) solved that problem. I set the min-absorb to 3hrs and max to 4 hours for about a month but saw no real improvement in SG ( stayed in the 1.25 range no matter what). Then I found that the temperature sensor had never been installed. My batteries are in my unheated basement and were at 50-55F all the time. With no temperature compensation and the absorb voltage set at 59.2v they weren’t getting what they needed (voltage should have been higher). Also at this time my installer told me he checked with Trojan and they assured him my SG should be 1.265 @ full charge based on the date stamped on the negative terminal. I called Trojan before he did and after he did and got 2 different answers. (1.265 or 1.277). Kind of miffed with this situation! Anyway, I did a couple good hard EQ’s and set the min-Absorb to 4hrs and the Max-Absorb to 4hrs and 5 minutes and have had it there for the last couple months and things are finally coming around. (Remember during Jan. and Feb. here I was getting very little sun). I measured the SG last night on all my cells and the average is up to ~ 1.272 with a high cell @ 1.277 and the low cell @ 1.263. So I am not buying Trojans 1.265SG. I have also noticed that my absorb voltage is being compensated higher that the 59.2 (~60.3v). I am in the process of dialing back the abs time or I may switch to end amps as I have a pretty good feel for where that value is. I have my FNDC BCF set @ 94%, and after my last EQ I unplugged it from the Hub to reset my 100% SOC, so that I would have a better baseline. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"My batteries are in my unheated basement and were at 50-55F all the time.
<snip>
I have my FNDC BCF set @ 94%, and after my last EQ I unplugged it from the Hub to reset my 100% SOC, so that I would have a better baseline.
Don't forget that the FNDC reports your SOC based upon the battery capacity, and the amphours drawn from the battery. It only knows the battery capacity that you tell it. If your batteries are cold your battery capacity is lower than spec and your FNDC will over estimate your SOC. My batteries, like yours, are cold in the winter and I tell my trimetric battery monitor to reduce battery capacity by about 15% in the winter.
--vtMaps4 X 235watt Samsung, Midnite ePanel, Outback VFX3524 FM60 & mate, 4 Interstate L16, trimetric, Honda eu2000i -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Don't forget that the FNDC reports your SOC based upon the battery capacity, and the amphours drawn from the battery. It only knows the battery capacity that you tell it. If your batteries are cold your battery capacity is lower than spec and your FNDC will over estimate your SOC. My batteries, like yours, are cold in the winter and I tell my trimetric battery monitor to reduce battery capacity by about 15% in the winter.
--vtMaps
Good point and thanks for the tip!! -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
After 10 years living on batteries, here are my quickie rules of thumb for happy batteries:
1. Batteries must be charged to 100% every day to prevent sulfation. Batteries work best when you don't use them.
A new battery bank can take months of careful daily EQ to eventually reach 100% charge. I call 100% charge C/100 Amps @ 16 volts @ 70 degrees F.
2. EQ @ 16 volts for 4 hours everyday.
3. Good water consumption is a sign of good health. Panic if a cell quits using water! Its sulfated!
4. A DC clamp meter is a must to monitor charge equality between strings. Rotate batteries to equalize strings.
5. If batteries sit next to each other they need to be rotated every year. Batteries create heat when charging and the hot sides/corners need to be rotated to outside surfaces regularly.
6. Avoid deep discharges or high currents whenever possible.
7. Keep a log book of your battery performance and maintenance.
It works for me! Happy batteries make me happy! -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
May I suggest to separate this into its own thread?After 10 years living on batteries ...
2. EQ @ 16 volts for 4 hours everyday.
Do I understand correctly that you were doing that with your GC batteries and they lasted 10 years? -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
feedhorn;
When you make jokes like that please use the smilies to indicate it is such. We do not want newcomers thinking they need to EQ their batteries daily or that high water consumption is a good thing, et cetera. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"May I suggest to separate this into its own thread?
Do I understand correctly that you were doing that with your GC batteries and they lasted 10 years?
Best I've got is 4 years from a set of GC batts. Eventually water consumption increases to become excessive.
I destroyed my first set with in 6 months due to chronic under charging.
I destroyed my second set due to a faulty jumper cable between strings. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I saw a set go 9 years before the person gave up with 30 % of capacity. A lot depends on your expectations and how you use them. I manage 32 banks of them and I figure them as 5 years and done. 6 of the 32 banks I own and lease and thats my business model, as the remaining 26 banks are replaced, I hope to have all of them as leased banks. Lazy people like to spend their money, what can I say. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Best I've got is 4 years from a set of GC batts. Eventually water consumption increases to become excessive.
According to data sheets, 4 years is what you would expect from GC batteries at fairly deep (50%) discharge every day. With a light use like yours, they're supposed to last longer. Perhaps you overcharged them too much. But 4 years with overcharging is certainly better than 1/2 year with underchaging.
I've got weired Trojan batteries that I can only charge at 64V (SG stay low if I use lower voltages) and it talkes at least 4 hours. So when it's sunny evey day, I, in fact, do equalization at 64V for 4 hours every day. I think about going straight to float in the morning and only allowing the full charge every 3 days, or perhaps every week. This might help to avoid excessive overcharging. But nobody really knows. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
One thing I have noticed is that the " Standard " capacity GC- 2, ones that are between 190-210 amp capacity ?? , have what I am going to call normal thickness plates and separators. The " High Capacity - HD " 220-230 amp capacity have very thin plates and separators there are many more plates than the Standard Battery. What this has to do with their longevity, I do not know. I have a set I am keeping a eye on to see if there is a difference in their life span. The weight of both types are about the same, somewhere in the 68 lb range. I did notice the High capacity seem to want to lose the SG balance easier, there is more stuffed into the same space and they do not gas as freely. The question is that even if they have more capacity, can they have a shortened life span ??
. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Blackcherry04 wrote: »The question is that even if they have more capacity, can they have a shortened life span ??
Yep.
Depending on exactly what they did to make them "hotter". Over time the plates erode as well as sulphate. Thicker plates then should theoretically work out to longer life. But if you put thinner plates in the same case and increase the surface area you get more capacity but less life. Likewise altering the SG can make the same battery lower capacity and longer life or higher capacity and shorter life. "So much" material in a given space equates to a finite amount of total power that can be divided up into capacity over time in various ratios.
That's the theory. What happens in real life is another thing entirely. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
Some Theories:
I believe that new batteries are made with some kind of anti-sulphate paste that tends to prevent destructive sulfation as the batteries are stored before sale and use. This goop makes the batteries hard to charge up to a true 100%. I think that most solar users never get their batteries up to 100% charge. Now if you put the batteries on a grid power charger for say 6 months then this goop will go away and the batts will reach 100% charge. Like if you keep your RV plugged in for most of the year.
Batts that have reached 100% charge and not allowed to sulphate will charge faster (bulk stage) and create less heat. I watch the max charge rate when running off generator to judge how 'clean' my batt plates are of that nasty sulphate stuff. If you screw up and let sulphate start to build up on plates it will show up and creating resistance to charging and heat. The max bulk charge rate will decrease. Once sulphate has established it reduces overall capacity of the battery but acts like now you have smaller batteries that charge faster. That can be deceiving and make you think all is well.
You can detect sufaction of plates by hygrometer readings but I find that difficult and its just better to watch water consumption carefully. Water consumption means you need to be overcharging. You at least need an amp hour meter to make sure your putting in at least 110% of the charge you remove each day. Batteries are not 100% efficient. To get 110% charge into your cells you need to spend some time at 16 volts everyday.
Remember that sulphate causes resistance that causes heat which lowers resistance and causes thermal runaway so maybe you need 120% overcharge to overcome the effects of sulphate. Its a vicous circle. Its best to keep fresh (discharge) sulphate from staying on your plates for more than a day. After more hours fresh sulphate hardens and gets impossible to remove.
Its only through experience that I have found that overcharging is always better than undercharging when it comes to keeping batteries in good shape. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I don't know about the paste, but you have a very good handle on how they react. It makes a big difference when someone like you that understands the charging cycle and battery reaction to it and lives with it everyday on a up close and personal basis.Some Theories:
I believe that new batteries are made with some kind of anti-sulphate paste that tends to prevent destructive sulfation as the batteries are stored before sale and use. This goop makes the batteries hard to charge up to a true 100%. I think that most solar users never get their batteries up to 100% charge. Now if you put the batteries on a grid power charger for say 6 months then this goop will go away and the batts will reach 100% charge. Like if you keep your RV plugged in for most of the year.
Batts that have reached 100% charge and not allowed to sulphate will charge faster (bulk stage) and create less heat. I watch the max charge rate when running off generator to judge how 'clean' my batt plates are of that nasty sulphate stuff. If you screw up and let sulphate start to build up on plates it will show up and creating resistance to charging and heat. The max bulk charge rate will decrease. Once sulphate has established it reduces overall capacity of the battery but acts like now you have smaller batteries that charge faster. That can be deceiving and make you think all is well.
You can detect sufaction of plates by hygrometer readings but I find that difficult and its just better to watch water consumption carefully. Water consumption means you need to be overcharging. You at least need an amp hour meter to make sure your putting in at least 110% of the charge you remove each day. Batteries are not 100% efficient. To get 110% charge into your cells you need to spend some time at 16 volts everyday.
Remember that sulphate causes resistance that causes heat which lowers resistance and causes thermal runaway so maybe you need 120% overcharge to overcome the effects of sulphate. Its a vicous circle. Its best to keep fresh (discharge) sulphate from staying on your plates for more than a day. After more hours fresh sulphate hardens and gets impossible to remove.
Its only through experience that I have found that overcharging is always better than undercharging when it comes to keeping batteries in good shape. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Batts that have reached 100% charge and not allowed to sulphate will charge faster (bulk stage) and create less heat. I watch the max charge rate when running off generator to judge how 'clean' my batt plates are of that nasty sulphate stuff. If you screw up and let sulphate start to build up on plates it will show up and creating resistance to charging and heat. The max bulk charge rate will decrease.
How do you determine "max bulk charge rate". When my batteries are in bulk stage they can eat as much energy as I can offer. I usually do 10-15% of C20, but I did 25% of C20 once, and I'm sure they would take more than this. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
here is a good article from Sandia on capacity loss and sulphation,
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDMQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.zetatalk3.com%2Fdocs%2FBatteries%2FLead_Acid%2FCapacity_Loss_in_PV_Batteries_and_Recovery_Procedures_1998.pdf&ei=ZulNUb_UGaqNigLTsIGwDA&usg=AFQjCNF-zblwSjarUDL4cjVbwOhOZPWyyQ&sig2=SRzv1oa_AOkUgbzdPADLMg&bvm=bv.44158598,d.cGE&cad=rja
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2 x Cisco WRT54GL i/c DD-WRT Rtr & Bridge,
Eu3/2/1000i Gens, 1680W & E-Panel/WBjr to come, CL #647 asleep
West Chilcotin, BC, Canada -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"How do you determine "max bulk charge rate". When my batteries are in bulk stage they can eat as much energy as I can offer. I usually do 10-15% of C20, but I did 25% of C20 once, and I'm sure they would take more than this.
I have a 100 amp charger that limits it bulk rate voltage at 14.10 volts. I get a charge rate of about 70A when the batteries are in perfect condition and discharged about 25%. That would be about C/8. This charge rates drops to about 40A in about 10 minutes and holds there for about an hour.
If the batteries are showing sulfaction of wear these numbers fall. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I've yet to see any battery manufacturer or charge controller maker recommend a daily EQ or such high Voltages for charging.
Kind of sounds like somebody is substituting higher Voltage for longer Absorb and as a result is going through a lot of water and getting only 4 years out of batteries that should last 8. The heat stress from this (and hitting nearly 2X normal current on a regular basis) can't be doing them any good either.
But hey, it's not my money so ... no one has to listen to me. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
North, you have to remember that a $360 set of GC-2's are a heck of a lot different than a $8,000 set of batteries. I have a test on someone's nickle now starting it's 3 rd year where the fuel savings alone have paid for a set of 10 GC-2's ( $900 ) Bulking at 250 amps. I drop one inverter / charger at 14.3V and absorb on the other one @ 125 amps. The heat build up to gassing is so small, it's not a issue, it's been monitored with a In-Cell temperature system, these are healthy batteries.How do you determine "max bulk charge rate". When my batteries are in bulk stage they can eat as much energy as I can offer. I usually do 10-15% of C20, but I did 25% of C20 once, and I'm sure they would take more than this. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Cariboocoot wrote: »
Kind of sounds like somebody is substituting higher Voltage for longer Absorb and as a result is going through a lot of water and getting only 4 years out of batteries that should last 8. The heat stress from this (and hitting nearly 2X normal current on a regular basis) can't be doing them any good either.
The problem is that there is only so many hours in a day for somebody living on solar power. The concept of absorb or float is ridiculous in the short winter days. With solar you got to jam in as much charge as you can as fast as you can. Never know when the clouds will come over.
Getting 16 volts for four hours a day is not easy except in the summer. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I'd be getting me a Honda 2000-3000-4000 and have it starting it early morning. You can get a few hrs head start on the day. It's the cost of doing business. Be thankful you don't have a 20 KW like me @ 2.25 gal + fuel per hour, it's Toyota Camry engine. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"The problem is that there is only so many hours in a day for somebody living on solar power. The concept of absorb or float is ridiculous in the short winter days. With solar you got to jam in as much charge as you can as fast as you can. Never know when the clouds will come over.
Getting 16 volts for four hours a day is not easy except in the summer.
Having been off-grid for 26 years in the Frozen North I'm familiar with the limitations. That's what generators are for. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"I have a 100 amp charger that limits it bulk rate voltage at 14.10 volts. I get a charge rate of about 70A when the batteries are in perfect condition and discharged about 25%. That would be about C/8. This charge rates drops to about 40A in about 10 minutes and holds there for about an hour.
If the batteries are showing sulfaction of wear these numbers fall.
In solar terms, bulk is when you put as much current as you have. At this stage all current goes to charging.
As soon as the set voltage is hit and you start limiting your current, that would be an absorption stage. Here parts of the current goes into charging and some goes to bubbling. If the battery lost some capacity (due sulphation or otherwise), this current will be naturally lower. However, it varies wildly with previous discharge level. If the battery has been discharged to 30% SOC, the current at the absorption state will be much higher and will decrease much slower than if it was discharged to 70% SOC. Therefore, I don't think it may help to judge battery capacity. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"
I think Chris Olsen has been very forth coming about what each of his Power sources produce and what he uses. He has some wind, if you don't you have to make up for it. I have seen him post that in the winter he doesn't even figure his PV in. If it were me, I'd have a big Industrial Charger @ 48 V and I'd run it to get me over the hump everyday, or take the long way around with a Honda to supplement, as Chris does. Even though I have the 20 KW, I probably put less than 150- 200 hrs last year and that is with a 4 ton AC. If it was easy and cheap, everybody would be doing it. -
Re: Charging my Batts: Round one - "Outback vs the Hydrometer"Cariboocoot wrote: »Kind of sounds like somebody is substituting higher Voltage for longer Absorb ...
I do too. I could charge at suggested voltages for 40 hours every day ...
or not ... Cariboocoot wrote: »But hey, it's not my money so ... no one has to listen to me.
Money ... Money I already lost
At the moment I decided to buy Trojans, not Surrettes. It's not mine anymore, but Trojan's.
That's not that I lose money because I charge batteries that way. That's I charge batteries that way because I didn't spend money wisely.Blackcherry04 wrote: »North, you have to remember that a $360 set of GC-2's are a heck of a lot different than a $8,000 set of batteries. I have a test on someone's nickle now starting it's 3 rd year where the fuel savings alone have paid for a set of 10 GC-2's ( $900 ) Bulking at 250 amps. I drop one inverter / charger at 14.3V and absorb on the other one @ 125 amps. The heat build up to gassing is so small, it's not a issue, it's been monitored with a In-Cell temperature system, these are healthy batteries.
Unless, by some miracle, those Trojans last for 15 years, I guess my next set will be no-brand GCs or L16s.
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